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Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

Theological and spiritual discussions within the context of a religious framework.
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TatilinaBanned

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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSat Dec 24, 2016 4:26 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?

Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:

Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.

Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?

Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?

Regards
DL


You remind me so much of Douglas Hall.

The bible says according to "god" that people perish because of a lack of knowledge. Again, accordingly to the bible, only " Jesus" can open the eyes of the blind and likewise, blind the eyes/minds (spiritual awakening/awareness).
Not everyone who seeks knowledge does so to become more like "god". Also knowledge can be truth or false, just like anything else, it could be useful, or not.

The question is, who the hell is god and what the hell is his problem?
Personally I'm starting to believe that god and the devil are one and the same.
He has serious issues. I think he's an idiot, I could have done a much better job.
What the hell kind of supposed perfect creator create such an imperfect regrettable human race like us. Also, it says that he knows the beginning and the end, knows the entire before it will happen through this sick and demented thing called prophecy (I wanna be a time traveler and change shit up :Crazy: )

Well he's pretty useless if you ask me.
I bathe in my sin and try not to divulge to deep into the knowledge of truth cause that shit is just disturbing and so morbid I prefer to stay out of the " rabbit hole". There is nothing pretty to see down there.
Chase the beast, or the beast will chase you.
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TatilinaBanned

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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSat Dec 24, 2016 4:40 am

Whoops! I kind of lost my train of thought there and didn't quite finish :Rofl:
As per knowing what will happen throughout time and well he admitted to screwing up in genesis, so what the hell was he thinking the second time around to give humankind a second chance? Apparently he wasn't thinking at all because he gave it another go. Then he had to go through the whole nonsense thing of becoming a man to die for sins, when he could have just abolished sin altogether and made everyone sinless. His whole process is stupid and just plain bullshit if you ask me.

Absolutely ridiculous.
Chase the beast, or the beast will chase you.
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSat Dec 24, 2016 5:11 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
God is the talking serpent of Eden. Ok.

Because you said that God and the talking serpent were the same above. Adam did go God to God in your analogy.

Belied above.

All thinking entities should resist any God that says not to increase your knowledge.

Fail.

You have never recognized that the Jews saw Eden as our place of elevation and not our fall have you?

Regards
DL


No. I did not make an analogy to compare to the story of Genesis which differentiates the serpent from "God" yet in my analogy make them one in the same. What I said was in my analogy, God was like a dictionary. The serpent was who he is (meaning the serpent was the serpent in my analogy as well). Hopefully that clarifies it.

Now the question is, why would you go to the SERPENT for knowledge or do what he asked/told/convinced/tricked you into doing instead of going to the dictionary itself? To take it a step further, why would you not go to the dictionary instead of doing what the dictionary that had the answers to your search knowledge said NOT to do?

Adam and Eve disobeyed the Creator and went elsewhere, instead of going to the Creator for the knowledge they sought. How does that make sense to you?
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Gnostic Bishop

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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSat Dec 24, 2016 7:26 pm

Tatilina wrote:Whoops! I kind of lost my train of thought there and didn't quite finish :Rofl:
As per knowing what will happen throughout time and well he admitted to screwing up in genesis, so what the hell was he thinking the second time around to give humankind a second chance? Apparently he wasn't thinking at all because he gave it another go. Then he had to go through the whole nonsense thing of becoming a man to die for sins, when he could have just abolished sin altogether and made everyone sinless. His whole process is stupid and just plain bullshit if you ask me.

Absolutely ridiculous.


Indeed.

If you consider what motivates religions, some of the ridicule can be forgiven, due to our Father Complex and hivish natures. We are just tribes and cannot ignore our genes and love of war and our need to be a member of a huge club for the sake of safety.

Keep up your free thinking. That is number 1 in Gnostic Christianity. We are abot 1/4 of the population and rising.

Regards
DL
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSat Dec 24, 2016 7:42 pm

KoncreteMind wrote:
Gnostic Bishop wrote:
God is the talking serpent of Eden. Ok.

Because you said that God and the talking serpent were the same above. Adam did go God to God in your analogy.

Belied above.

All thinking entities should resist any God that says not to increase your knowledge.

Fail.

You have never recognized that the Jews saw Eden as our place of elevation and not our fall have you?

Regards
DL


No. I did not make an analogy to compare to the story of Genesis which differentiates the serpent from "God" yet in my analogy make them one in the same. What I said was in my analogy, God was like a dictionary. The serpent was who he is (meaning the serpent was the serpent in my analogy as well). Hopefully that clarifies it.

Now the question is, why would you go to the SERPENT for knowledge or do what he asked/told/convinced/tricked you into doing instead of going to the dictionary itself? To take it a step further, why would you not go to the dictionary instead of doing what the dictionary that had the answers to your search knowledge said NOT to do?

Adam and Eve disobeyed the Creator and went elsewhere, instead of going to the Creator for the knowledge they sought. How does that make sense to you?


A mature mind would have just recanted. This aside and to your main point and dictionary that does not kill so many of us the way God is shown to do in your myths.

The dictionary, as you name God in your analogy, was, as he always ever was, --- absentee. All that was left of his knowledge was left was the knowledge off the one Tree of Knowledge. That is all knowledge to discerning minds.

And as you indicated, God had left all the tricksters of the bible there with Adam and Eve to insure that their natural curiosity worked. He, as nature of course, as there is no supernatural God, created the trait od desire in mankind, which must have the knowledge of good and evil.

Those tricksters change a good God and Father to a really poor Father, if you maintain thinking of Eden as our fall instead of our elevation.

Having our moral eyes opened regardless of what you call sin is Gods greatest gift to man. That is why it is our elevation. Go Eve go.

Keep having your eyes opened.

Regards
DL
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSun Dec 25, 2016 1:58 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:
A mature mind would have just recanted. This aside and to your main point and dictionary that does not kill so many of us the way God is shown to do in your myths.

The dictionary, as you name God in your analogy, was, as he always ever was, --- absentee. All that was left of his knowledge was left was the knowledge off the one Tree of Knowledge. That is all knowledge to discerning minds.

And as you indicated, God had left all the tricksters of the bible there with Adam and Eve to insure that their natural curiosity worked. He, as nature of course, as there is no supernatural God, created the trait od desire in mankind, which must have the knowledge of good and evil.

Those tricksters change a good God and Father to a really poor Father, if you maintain thinking of Eden as our fall instead of our elevation.

Having our moral eyes opened regardless of what you call sin is Gods greatest gift to man. That is why it is our elevation. Go Eve go.

Keep having your eyes opened.

Regards
DL


Recant what? You misunderstood what I said as me placing God as being the serpent in an analogy that was to be compared to the story of Genesis which clearly differentiates God from the serpent. No harm no foul. But lets not throw unnecessary digs about "mature" minds when you simply misunderstood what I said..

In the story of Genesis, which is what I thought we were discussing, God was absolutely not absentee. So again, if they sought knowledge and had the Creator there, why would they need to go to the tree of knowledge for it? If Adam and Eve were thirsty for knowledge, why listen to the serpent and go to the tree for it, instead of the Creator who created Adam, Eve, the serpent and the tree? Didnt see an answer the first time but maybe you just missed it. It makes no sense to ignore the Creator who has ALL the knowledge you have, disobey Him, then go get the knowledge from the tree. How does this make sense to you?

My belief is that we were given free will. Which is factual no matter who you say "God" is (assuming you believe there is an entity that created all things... ). So no matter the "trickster", no matter the traits humans were given or that exist that humans could POTENTIALLY succumb to, at the end of the day, its all free will. Choice. And they chose wrong. You say "they elevated us" well why is the world worse? Why hasnt the world "elevated" in righteousness or morality? Im in my mid 20's and even I have noticed a fall in my short time. I can already see the differences between my generation, and the ones coming after me. So how much more, for my parents? And my grandparents? Great grandparents? Why are the elite ruling the world not in righteous ways, but in evil? Why is there racism running rampant in the US still?
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostSun Dec 25, 2016 7:16 pm

KoncreteMind wrote:
Recant what? You misunderstood what I said as me placing God as being the serpent in an analogy that was to be compared to the story of Genesis which clearly differentiates God from the serpent. No harm no foul. But lets not throw unnecessary digs about "mature" minds when you simply misunderstood what I said..


You are correct in that it does not really matter, because, if you introduce a supernatural aspect to God while ignoring that it is nature that is in charge of things, all supernatural entities introduced within the bible must be fictitious.

The WORD becomes just an adult fairy tale, which is in reality what it is.

Quite astute of you buddy.

In the story of Genesis, which is what I thought we were discussing, God was absolutely not absentee. So again, if they sought knowledge and had the Creator there, why would they need to go to the tree of knowledge for it?


When God returns to Eden and is looking for Adam, a rather strange notion for a God who has us all following his great plan, showing that God was indeed away from Eden.

Then again, if God is in the supernatural, then he is directly in the talking serpent and or Satan whom God stupidly pit in Eden.

God's own power is working threw the talking serpent and Satan.

If Adam and Eve were thirsty for knowledge, why listen to the serpent and go to the tree for it, instead of the Creator who created Adam, Eve, the serpent and the tree?


Adam and Eve were not thirsty for knowledge as they had no desire in them due to their mental blindness. Too stupid to even reproduce back in Gen 1 until after they finally showed from the partaking of knowledge and education. After a time they graduated with their next challenge before mankind. To have desire for anything, you need knowledge. For God or man to deny mankind knowledge is a satanic act and that was what Yahweh tried to do.

If you do not give Yahweh a thumbs down, you might have to wonder why you follow such a genocidal son murdering prick.

Didn't see an answer the first time but maybe you just missed it. It makes no sense to ignore the Creator who has ALL the knowledge you have, disobey Him, then go get the knowledge from the tree. How does this make sense to you?


It makes sense to ignore your faith based notions as they are of knowledge that you cannot possibly know.

You forget that God, the God whose mouth you are filling with your supernatural garbage, is said by most religions and their sheeple coward who would get to heaven by putting themselves where they can suck blood from Jesus's wounds, that God is unknowable, unfathomable and cannot be defined and is to always remain a mystery. Get with the program.

My belief is that we were given free will. Which is factual no matter who you say "God" is (assuming you believe there is an entity that created all things... ). So no matter the "trickster", no matter the traits humans were given or that exist that humans could POTENTIALLY succumb to, at the end of the day, its all free will. Choice. And they chose wrong. You say "they elevated us" well why is the world worse? Why hasnt the world "elevated" in righteousness or morality? Im in my mid 20's and even I have noticed a fall in my short time. I can already see the differences between my generation, and the ones coming after me. So how much more, for my parents? And my grandparents? Great grandparents? Why are the elite ruling the world not in righteous ways, but in evil? Why is there racism running rampant in the US still?


Do not rant.

All you say of society is partly true but you are accentuating the negative while ignoring the positives. Check any of the stats for your greatest evil. Poverty is almost beaten. the flow to the poor is continuing nicely. Violent death, by all means, are at the best levels that we have ever enjoyed. The same would apply to slavery. In these, your fall is an elevation.

Sure, we have also screwed up the environment and economic factors that we are handing to our children, but like most, we will ignore duty and honor and we will ignore our children here. We are slaves to our systems and I guess we do not mind insuring that our children also become even poorer slaves.

Regards
DL
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostTue Dec 27, 2016 1:51 am

Gnostic Bishop wrote:Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?

Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:

Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


This was your first post in this thread. to which I asked, how does it make sense to you, that in the story, instead of going to "God" for knowledge, they go to the tree? You havent given one concrete answer to the question. Its not even difficult and there isnt even a right or wrong answer to it. Its just logically speaking, why wouldnt they go to the Creator of everything (including them and the tree) instead of going to the tree by the way of Satan for answers? If they sought knowledge why not go to the Source of ALL knowledge instead of a tree?

The rest of your post, seems to be a "rant" which you previously told me to stop doing. Nothing in Genesis says that "God" was not there or left and returned later. There is still slavery, even in the US. The poor in the UK and US is growing not shrinking. But even if these things werent true, how are these things proof that what happened in the garden was GOOD? Slavery, murder, lying, deception etc... happened AFTER the garden of eden. So how was anything "elevated" AFTER the garden of eden if the world is getting much worse and the people in power (who arent righteous) seem to be gaining more and more power/authority over the rest of the world? Slavery, murder, lying etc.. isnt on the decrease (imo at least).
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostTue Dec 27, 2016 4:11 pm

Gen 3;9 And the LORD God called unto the man, and said unto him: 'Where art thou?'

As you can see, God had to be absent as he lost track of Where A & E were.

This belies what you put.

A & E could not desire anything without the knowledge of good and evil. They were blind and stupid before they ate and to not eat would have been the epitome of stupidity. And God asking them to stay mentally blind was quite wrong.

Do you agree?

Regards
DL
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Re: Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

PostTue Dec 27, 2016 11:52 pm

Gnostic Bishop wrote:Gen 3;9 And the LORD God called unto the man, and said unto him: 'Where art thou?'

As you can see, God had to be absent as he lost track of Where A & E were.

This belies what you put.


No. This is like me and you being in a three story house and you yelling from the bottom floor: "KM where are you?". This doesnt make you absent. This doesnt mean that if I sought to ask you something, that I couldnt because you're "absent". Nothing in Genesis says He left or returned to the garden of Eden. Therefore, theres nothing in the story that suggests He was absent.

A & E could not desire anything without the knowledge of good and evil. They were blind and stupid before they ate and to not eat would have been the epitome of stupidity. And God asking them to stay mentally blind was quite wrong.

Do you agree?

Regards
DL


The problem we have here is that your opening post said that Adam and Eve were punished for seeking knowledge (of course by way of the tree). Yet when I ask you why they didnt go to the Creator of everything for they knowledge they sought and not the tree, you start changing things. So I ask again, why do you think it would be smarter for them to go to the ONE thing that were told not to for knowledge, when they could have easily went to the Creator who was amongst them for the knowledge?

I dont believe they were blind/stupid either. I just think they were supposed to grow into things and not simply have it all at once..
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