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Discussion - not Debate ???

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Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 3:35 am

Assalaam alaikum - peace and blessings from God be with you.

We're all tired of the argumentation between the worlds two largest faith groups - Christianity and Islam. How about discourse though?

Dr James White - Christian Theologian and Dr Yasir Qadhi - Muslim Theologian, have a wonderfully intelligent exchange which I believe we members from the Christian and Muslim faith groups here on VF really can learn from.

I'll let this video do the talking.

phpBB [video]


Second part here:

phpBB [video]


I know they are long - but hey, when it's this good, you kinda wish there was a part three too.

I look forward to some friendly exchanges God willing,

God bless,

Scimi
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I have nothing to do with any recommendations to join any war on any person , race or community. I do not support ISIS nor any other movement, I seek opportunities to unite mankind, I seek to look at common ground and choose to ignore differences. I do not support violence, I condemn it. I have no affiliations with any promoting of violence be it political, racial or religious.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 5:36 am

If this is the last post I ever make on this forum, it would be a good one because I managed to make this thread first.

Sometimes, we come across discussions which revive our belief in humanity - this is one of those discourses.

After all we've been through here and on that other forum between Christian and Muslim, I honestly feel this thread is much needed for both our faith groups.

Honestly speaking, I'm hoping Thunderian will share something here with us too. Lately, Thunderian and I have been getting along for the sake of God. And it's going well. Now, if you know how we were at each others throats in that other forum - then you're probably scratching your heads thinking wt...

...well, God wills, and what God wills, manifests.

God bless you all.

Scimi
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I have nothing to do with any recommendations to join any war on any person , race or community. I do not support ISIS nor any other movement, I seek opportunities to unite mankind, I seek to look at common ground and choose to ignore differences. I do not support violence, I condemn it. I have no affiliations with any promoting of violence be it political, racial or religious.
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Karlysymon

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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 9:24 am

I will watch the videos a lil bit later and reply. In the meantime,
Scimitar wrote:Honestly speaking, iam hoping Thunderian will share
something here with us too.
Lately, Thunderian and I have been getting along for the sake of God. And it's going well. Now, if you know how we were at each others throats in that other forum - then you're probably
scratching your heads thinking wt......well, God wills, and what God wills, manifests.

Indeed, God moves and works in mysterious ways! Really glad your making your Heavenly Father proud! Clearly you both won't be at each other's throats in heaven, right?
Psalm 133
Behold, how good and how pleasant it is For brethren to dwell together in unity! It is like the precious oil upon the head,
Running down on the beard,
The beard of Aaron,
Running down on the edge of
his garments. 3 It is like the dew of Hermon,
Descending upon the mountains of Zion;
For there the Lord commanded the blessing—
Life forever more.
Hebrews 12:14
Make every effort to live in peace with everyone and to be holy; without holines no one will see the Lord.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 4:28 pm

I'm still in touch with some of the old guard from previous VC forums, Christian members whom i have met in real life, shared meals and had great discussions with. Not debate. Discussions. Which is why this two part video has struck a chord with me. This is what I am about. Ever since I joined the VC boards back in 2011, I was witnessing the plethora of misinformed media monkeying polarising Islam off the back of the very same media they claim was "fake". As you can imagine, I was at a loss to understand this compromised justification for their hatred. But thank God for intellect as some Christians, like Let's Glow, did not parrot that lamestream and instead, found a common ground with me, and we built from that. There was one version of VC forum where the arguments were minimal and the getting along part was really something to be proud of - but that didn't last because Mikey boy closed the forum down, and we ended up back at square one.

Together, Muslims and Christians make up more than half of the worlds population. We cannot wish for world peace unless we work together, stand together in solidarity against the elitist agenda who are slowly destroying the image of both our faith groups, Christianity and Islam. They have thus far been very successful at causing animosity and divide among us, and it's obvious to see why now.

Yet we are stuck in this matrix loop if we do not seek to break free of convention and instead, lead.

I hope my words do not fall on deaf ears, or blind eyes, or closed hearts.

God bless,

Scimi
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I have nothing to do with any recommendations to join any war on any person , race or community. I do not support ISIS nor any other movement, I seek opportunities to unite mankind, I seek to look at common ground and choose to ignore differences. I do not support violence, I condemn it. I have no affiliations with any promoting of violence be it political, racial or religious.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 4:58 pm

Hi Scimi....I think its very interesting that you are interested in world peace and joining muslims and Christians together. I would think that the animosity has more to do with the differences in religious beliefs than an elite agenda?
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 5:52 pm

Hi Karly-what your saying is not Biblically possible...
John 3:16
For God so loved the word that He gave His only begotten Son, that whomsoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Islam doesn't teach that Jesus is God's Son.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 6:13 pm

Lisa wrote:Hi Scimi....


Oh wow, had no idea you had joined :Smile:

Great to see you here Lisa, hope you been well and good. Just on a quick side note, I popped into that "other" forum and agreed with your stance on Loki's thread "A Jew, a Christian and an Atheist... smoke weed". Totally with you on that one.

Lisa wrote:I think its very interesting that you are interested in world peace and joining muslims and Christians together. I would think that the animosity has more to do with the differences in religious beliefs than an elite agenda?


I used to believe that around 15 years ago - I honestly thought the animosity was due to the theological differences in our two faith groups. The more I studied, the more i saw a hidden hand at work and it was sinister (latin meaning coupled with modern day understanding meant).

This is what I discovered, and this is what I believe:

The enemies of God Almighty, have for millenia, put our three faith groups up against each other by proverbially stirring the pot so to speak. I can think of so many examples but to post them here would be of no use, simply because this thread would become all about that - however, i think it is safe to say that, we can unite as is evident in the two videos above - on matters of morality, justice and equity - because these are the things which facilitate for us a fair society where each man woman and child has their rights given to them by God - as is taught to us in our scriptures.

Instead - the elites have totally ignored any discourse and preferred to paint and taint with their colour blind palette, lies which make us mistrust each other.

On the web, I see a lot of mistrust. But in real life, I have friends who are from all walks of life and our relationship is built on mutual merit. Not what we believe.

Jesus pbuh never passed a man without smiling. Neither did Muhammad pbuh. Why are we frowning? We're doing this all wrong.

We forgot how to smile at strangers - we forgot how to make people feel safe - we forgot how to love. Because the evil doers are setting the standard and we are like sheep.

Where are the lambs?

It's sad.

Lisa wrote:Hi Karly-what your saying is not Biblically possible...
John 3:16
For God so loved the word that He gave His only begotten Son, that whomsoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Islam doesn't teach that Jesus is God's Son.


This verse has been proven to be an interpolation and removed from many versions of the bible now. You can't hold that as your caveat. But I will entertain this because you believe it - and in fairness I will honour that.

Dr James White - the Theologian in the video - believes it is more than possible - and he proves this in the above two vids. So does Dr Yasir Qadhi - also an expert theologian - now, if these two experts of theology hailing from opposing camps of belief, can believe in a common ground based on morality, justice and equity - then you don't have an excuse either.

Not just this, but check out what over 120 Christian denominations are on ball with: http://www.acommonword.com

here are the Christian responses: http://www.acommonword.com/category/sit ... responses/

here are the Jewish responses: http://www.acommonword.com/category/sit ... responses/

it's not just possible Lisa, it's happening as we speak and has been for over five years now. And I am a part of the ACommonWord initiative, a member who works to fulfil his end of the promise in seeking unity based on morality and the teachings of how to live according to God. I can honestly say that when we examine the Qur'an and the New Testament for the beneficial verses of how we should live according to God - we don't find much to disagree about - but much to share and shout about - so why are we not uniting?

Lisa, please watch the videos as discussin anything here without knowing what is discussed in them, is gonna take this thread into muddy waters, and no one likes muddy waters.

God bless,

Scimi
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I have nothing to do with any recommendations to join any war on any person , race or community. I do not support ISIS nor any other movement, I seek opportunities to unite mankind, I seek to look at common ground and choose to ignore differences. I do not support violence, I condemn it. I have no affiliations with any promoting of violence be it political, racial or religious.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 6:27 pm

Hi again Scimi...I just joined when I saw your thread...had to respond I guess. :)

I don't have the time to watch the videos sorry, but I did want to add my 2 cents to your discussion. Because I do believe its a difference in our beliefs that separate us. No real Christian is going to unite with a false system, we are called to be in the truth not to muddy it with the falseness of other systems. That's probably why you won't see everyone who calls themselves Christians uniting. Some will because they have been deceived that uniting is good. If it was all good for us to be united I suppose that we wouldn't have been scattered at the Tower of Babel?

I would say that the world's elites are trying very hard to get people to unite and don't want us separated, look at the UN and the EU... So, I think you're just fitting in with those plans...because they do want a united religion also...and to that end Scimi it will happen, the Bible says it will.

Ya, I have seen the common word website and all the signatures. There is also a common word like website between protestants and catholics and the pope seeks to unite all religions as well. It's an amazing push that's been happening these last few years.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 6:33 pm

Lisa wrote:Hi again Scimi...I just joined when I saw your thread...had to respond I guess. :)


Your views are always welcome, :)

Lisa wrote:I don't have the time to watch the videos sorry, but I did want to add my 2 cents to your discussion. Because I do believe its a difference in our beliefs that separate us. No real Christian is going to unite with a false system, we are called to be in the truth not to muddy it with the falseness of other systems. That's probably why you won't see everyone who calls themselves Christians uniting. Some will because they have been deceived that uniting is good. If it was all good for us to be united I suppose that we wouldn't have been scattered at the Tower of Babel?

I would say that the world's elites are trying very hard to get people to unite and don't want us separated, look at the UN and the EU... So, I think you're just fitting in with those plans...because they do want a united religion also...and to that end Scimi it will happen, the Bible says it will.

Ya, I have seen the common word website and all the signatures. There is also a common word like website between protestants and catholics and the pope seeks to unite all religions as well. It's an amazing push that's been happening these last few years.


Ah, the issues you raised have been discussed in the two videos at length by two Doctors of Theology, Lisa, and they see no reason why Muslims and Christians cannot unite on the common ground - barring the theology.

They've both proven this, and not just the two of them. In my last post I linked you to the ACommonWord site where Christian scholars, priests, pastors, etc and Jewish Rabbi's have all agreed and commented that "common ground is warranted" and further "much in need in today's world".

Now, when the leaders of your faith tradition, my faith tradition, and the Jewish faith traditions all sit on the same platform sharing bread - you clearly see why. These are the real believers. Not those who "excuse" common ground due to a difference in belief, as you believe - and you are no expert. Neither am I, which is why I seek to understand if this is possible and examine the arguments for and against common ground within the Abrahamic faith traiditons, and find myself wondering why the world hasn't caught onto this subtle yet profound understanding.

Like I said, your points of view remain in limbo because:

Lisa wrote:I don't have the time to watch the videos sorry,


That's a real shame :(

God bless,

Scimi
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I have nothing to do with any recommendations to join any war on any person , race or community. I do not support ISIS nor any other movement, I seek opportunities to unite mankind, I seek to look at common ground and choose to ignore differences. I do not support violence, I condemn it. I have no affiliations with any promoting of violence be it political, racial or religious.
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Re: Discussion - not Debate ???

PostMon Mar 20, 2017 6:49 pm

What do they do with their beliefs then? Sideline them for the common good? Do they pray together? And i apologize if that's in the video....
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